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Drummond
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(Date Posted:03/21/2003 13:10:33)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Print/0,3858,4630994,00.htmlCommentPeaceniks lost the war but changed the shape of battleThe anti-war movement transformed the landscape and our leaders have had to respondJonathan FreedlandSaturday March 22, 2003The GuardianThe peace movement may have lost the war, but it is fighting on. Indeed, it even seems to have won the odd battle. For in ways that few could have predicted, the anti-war campaign has helped shape the way the war itself is being fought.Start with the evidence that the peace camp is refusing to wave the white flag, in Britain and beyond. As promised, the first day of military action brought protesters on to the streets in every major city in the land. In London, police found themselves stretched to capacity as they dealt with one sit-down protest after another, sprouting all over the capital. Yesterday, peaceniks got on their bikes, holding up traffic in London and Sheffield. Today there will be another anti-war demo in London. No one expects the gargantuan figures achieved on February 15, but the commitment is still there.As it is around the world. US embassies have been besieged with protesters from Quito to Bangkok, Buenos Aires to Cairo, with a candlelit vigil in Berlin and a general strike in Athens. The German protest was led by schoolchildren, a sign that the phenomenon of youth protest which has surprised so many here is not confined to Britain: if anything, this war seems to have politicised a whole new generation. Those kids who skipped school to protest against a faraway war, whether in Bristol or Berlin, will never forget the experience.The mood at some of the demos is doubtless one of anger but also gloomy resignation. After all, the peaceniks lost the big campaign: they did not, despite their efforts, stop the war. They could be forgiven for feeling like New York Times columnist Nicholas Kristof, who wrote yesterday: "Those of us who have opposed this war need to recognise that we lost the debate. It's time to move on."No wonder American peaceniks feel that way: according to one poll yesterday, more than 70% of Americans back George Bush's decision to go to war against Iraq. But public opinion outside America, including in Britain, breaks the opposite way. Peace activists outside the US have no reason to feel they "lost the debate". In many ways, they won it.Which brings us to the strange, unexpected influence the anti-war effort seems to have had on the first stages of the conflict. Last night appeared to mark, at last, the beginning of the long-threatened "shock and awe", a ground-quaking, sky-burning display as America pounded Baghdad from the air.But the start, at least, of Operation Iraqi Freedom was not like that; it did not come as previously advertised. Instead, it seemed to have been devised with one eye on the concerns of the anti-war movement.The campaign began not with "shock and awe" but a subtler knife, aimed at the surgical decapitation of Saddam Hussein and his regime. One night's bombing of Baghdad lasted no more than an hour. The terrifying spectaculars threatened by Rumsfeld and the boys, reminiscent of the fireworks of the first Gulf war, only materialised last night.There could be a stack of explanations for that initial deployment of the short, sharp blow. US planners were embarrassed by their performance in Afghanistan, where they managed to drop bomb after bomb - and still miss Mullah Omar and Osama bin Laden. This time they wanted to be nimble and flexible - able to react to up-to-the-minute intelligence, like the tip-off of Saddam's whereabouts which prompted Wednesday's opening assault - rather than simply flatten Iraq only to see their man get away. (They still don't know for sure, incidentally, who they hit on opening night. The US even got Saddam's former mistress, Parisoula Lampsos, to examine tapes of the Iraqi dictator's dawn TV address, bragging of his survival. Ms Lampsos has correctly separated Saddam from his lookalikes more than a dozen times, say US sources, but she insists the man in the Thursday broadcast was not him.)But there may be another motive for the initial preference for short-and-sweet over shock-and-awe. The US might have wanted to avoid a wave of worldwide revulsion. A series of tight, well-aimed strikes at the regime would have confounded the global fear of colossal Iraqi civilian casualties. It's as if Washington had heard the peace movement's objection to this war - that too many innocents would die - and was attempting to heed it. (Now the US can, at least, say it tried its best, but that it didn't bring instant results.)The irony here is that the architect of the new, more targeted approach was the hated Rumsfeld, while the doctrine he was effectively replacing - the belief in immediate, "overwhelming force" - was first articulated during Operation Desert Storm by Colin Powell, darling of the European peace camp. "[We'd like] a lot of Powell and very little of Rumsfeld," requested the Spanish PM of Bush earlier this month. In the first 48 hours of battle, that wisdom was apparently turned on its head.The Americans listened to their critics in other matters of strategy, too. A loud complaint in the first Gulf war, and in every conflict since, was that Americans fight "cowards' wars". They prefer to drop bombs from the safe distance of 15,000ft rather than expose themselves to the danger of ground battle, said the critics. That refrain was a clamour in the Kosovo war of 1999, and heard in Afghanistan in 2001, too.This time the Americans are doing precisely what was demanded of them: risking their own necks by sending in ground forces. The speed of the land war, with desert convoys rolling into southern Iraq from Kuwait almost immediately, stunned the armchair generals, who assumed the US would do a whole lot more "softening up" from the air first.Ground troops might all be part of Rumsfeld's new, more light-footed style. It's also true that September 11 has fundamentally changed US attitudes to casualties: now, say many Americans, no price is too high to fend off a potential threat. What's not in doubt is that anti-war voices have changed the terms of debate.There are smaller examples, too. "It's all about oil," opponents of a military attack have chanted, a tad simplistically, from the very beginning. The claim was dismissed as paranoid nonsense, but it obviously stung just enough to make both London and Washington keen to deflect it. Why else have both moved swiftly to announce that Iraq's oil wealth will be held in a UN trust, to be spent only on the Iraqi people themselves? The peace movement made it impossible for the US, in particular, to do anything else.Critics have railed against Washington for its gunslinging unilateralism, lambasting the US for playing the lone ranger. So the first sentence of George Bush's TV address on Wednesday night referred to "coalition forces". Of course he spoiled the multilateralist feel of the phrase by preceding it with "on my orders" - suggesting he is in charge even of the British army - but the thought was there.And perhaps the clearest proof of the anti-war camp's efforts came from our own prime minister: "I know this course of action has produced deep divisions of opinion in our country," he said, just seconds into his own TV message to the nation. No leader wants to go into a war admitting such a thing. But Blair had no choice. As with much else, the peace movement has changed the landscape for this conflict - and the men of war are having to deal with it.j.freedland@guardian.co.uk

--------------------------------------------------------------
From American Splendor

Student to Harvey Pekar: "It"s hard enough trying to convince people that socialism is a good thing without basing your argument on some abstract theory of human nature. Plato tried and failed. Fourier tried and failed. Marx tried and failed. Sartre tried and failed."

Harvey Pekar: "Well maybe I c"n learn from their mistakes."

Stumpy
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(Date Posted:03/21/2003 20:50:02)

Reply to : Drummond -----agree with the fact that demonstrators did in fact have an impact, raised the consciences how this war would be waged.  I just have deep reservations as to this administrations truthfulness/sincerity. (Oil for Iraqi citizens future but talk of putting in "trust" with the UN?)


Last evening I  listened to Rumsfield explain repeatedly of superior technology/accuracy/ sophistication of weapontry as tho this were such a gift to humanity. Others might see it differently when all hell is raining down on them, their loved ones, the cities they grew up in and learned to love. His speech/this war left me disgusted.


In our rush to bring freedom to the Iraqi people this is what we leave in our wake.


Some may not wish to listen/view the following.  I did and didn't find it that difficult but then I am a bit familiar/seen this sort of thing before. please understand it is not my intent to offend anyone but it is information that needs to be addressed and not totally ignore. The truth often hurts........


 















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peace.gif

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I have created this site because I feel very strongly that our country is headed in  a terribly  wrong direction.  The  domestic and foreign policies of the Bush  Administration  are being sold to the American public in an Orwellian manner that truly frightens me.    For example, the use of the word "unpatriotic" to describe those who express  dissent is the oldest ploy of tyrants.  I can no longer sit back and do nothing more than mumble dissent under my breath while the hearts and minds of American Citizens are being manipulated  by  outright lies, which cannot easily be seen as such because they are artfully mixed with the truth; which I repeat, is  the oldest ploy of tyrants.

____________________________________________________________________ "''"



 

PLEASE NOTE: This web site has no affiliation with the Howard Dean Presidential Campaign.  I simply endorse this great Presidential Candidate. In some of the following pages I will offer information regarding his campaign.  It is important to note that the views expressed on this web site are for the most part my own.  Any views or commentaries found on this site which  can be  attributed  to Howard Dean will also include the URL link to their original source.

____________________________________________________________________ "''"


 

"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar." -- Julius Caesar

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"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." -- Herman Goering (second in command to Adolf Hitler) at the Nuremberg Trials

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depletedu.jpeg




Depleted uranium is what is left over when most of the highly radioactive types (isotopes) of uranium are removed for use as nuclear fuel or nuclear weapons. Depleted uranium is a  densely heavy radioactive material used in armor-piercing munitions and in enhanced armor protection for some Abrams tanks. It is now the USA's weapon of choice, and it has been used extensively in the first Persian Gulf War, in Kosovo, in Afghanistan, and it is  being used again in the newly declared war against Iraq.


(Note: I have decided  not to post  the  very graphic photos of the sick,  dying, and deformed  children resulting from exposure to these Nuclear Weapons). 


_________________________________________________________________________________

--------------------------------------------------------------
"Have mercy on my soul

I'll never let you know

Where my mind has been....."



Angels Would Fall/M. Etheridge



"Did you take it too far?

Did you forget who you are?

Did you stash your soul into

the closet forever.......?

Beth Hart

Drummond
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(Date Posted:03/24/2003 12:03:34)

Those are some great quotes Stumpy!


 

--------------------------------------------------------------
From American Splendor

Student to Harvey Pekar: "It"s hard enough trying to convince people that socialism is a good thing without basing your argument on some abstract theory of human nature. Plato tried and failed. Fourier tried and failed. Marx tried and failed. Sartre tried and failed."

Harvey Pekar: "Well maybe I c"n learn from their mistakes."

dillard10
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(Date Posted:03/24/2003 20:43:23)

Thanks for posting the article ... this whole war is so depressing it is great to see a little sign of hope!  I am sharing the article with friends now ...

--------------------------------------------------------------
The sun's still in the sky

The moon is there at night

The ground is still underfoot

And still holds you.

Sinead O'Connor - Gospel Oak CD

katseye
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(Date Posted:03/24/2003 22:02:48)

Reply to : Stumpy





Last evening Ilistened to Rumsfield explain repeatedly of superior technology/accuracy/ sophistication of weapontry as tho this were such a gift to humanity. Others might see it differently when all hell is raining down on them, their loved ones, the cities they grew up in and learned to love. His speech/this war left me disgusted.In our rush to bring freedom to the Iraqi people this is what we leave in our wake.








What she said.



And thanks for the quotes from Caesar and Goering, Stumpy. I've seen them both before, but right now I think I'm inclined to put them on my refrigerator door.



And there's another article thanking the anti-war demonstrators in the SF Chronicle this morning:



http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/archive/2003/03/25/eguillermo.DTL



Some of my favorite parts:







It's barely about liberation -- Iraqis aren't exactly welcoming our troops with open arms. It's only a liberation of sorts for some conservative think tankers who've been in exile since the first Bush administration, and who now find themselves back in power with what some analysts call a "hammerlock" on U.S. foreign policy.












In a place as serene as Oregon, an anti-terrorism measure has already been proposed. Senate Bill 742 defines the issue so broadly that the definition of "terrorism" could include a protest march, with a penalty of life imprisonment -- a high price to pay for expressing free speech. The irony, of course, is that those who defend the war as a fight for Iraqi freedom seem to have forgotten that the principle of freedom still applies at home.








kat

Stumpy
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(Date Posted:03/25/2003 17:11:40)

--------------------------------------------------------------
"Have mercy on my soul

I'll never let you know

Where my mind has been....."



Angels Would Fall/M. Etheridge



"Did you take it too far?

Did you forget who you are?

Did you stash your soul into

the closet forever.......?

Beth Hart

 Welcome to The Collection of Flashlights!Wolf-eyes ,your eyes break the darkness!
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