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snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/22/2006 4:42 AM)

Great article...enjoy!When Religion is an AddictionByBob MinorI remember hearing popular psychological speaker and writer John Bradshaw say that the "high" one gets from being righteous was similar to the high of cocaine. As both a former monk and addict, he knew the feelings personally.As the religious right pushes its anti-gay, anti-women's reproductive rights, anti-science, pro-profit agenda nationally and in state capitals across the nation and wins, that high is a sweet fix for the addicted. It gives them a comforting feeling of relief that they're really right, okay, worthwhile, and acceptable.Like all fixes, though, it doesn't last. So, the addict is driven to seek another and another - another issue, another evil, another paranoiac threat to defeat. It can't ever end. Like the need for heavier doses, the causes have to become bigger and more evil in the addict's mind to provide the fix.This mind-altering fix of righteousness covers their paranoid shame-based feelings about the internal and external dangers stalking them. The victim-role language of their dealers, right-wing religious leaders, feeds it. Like alcoholism and drug addiction, the fix numbs the religious addict against any feelings about how their addiction affects others.Religion doesn't have to be this way; it can be healing. But what we see in the dominant religious/political right-wing fundamentalism that's driving the debate on most conservative issues (political, social, economic, international) is anything but healthy. It's what addiction specialists call a process addiction, like sex or romance addiction, or workaholism. In an addictive society, such addictions are encouraged.Like substance addictions, it takes over, dominates life, pushes other issues to the background, tells them how and what to feel to prevent them from facing their real feelings about themselves and life, creates a mythology about the world, protects its "stash," and supports their denial that they have a problem. Addiction specialist Anne Wilson Schaef would say, like all addictions, religious addiction is progressive and fatal.If you're outside the addiction, you've probably wondered about what's going on, what's the dynamic that's driving the right-wing religious agenda that looks so hateful and destructive. Why is it so hard to crack? Why won't evidence or logic work?If you're an enabler or the addict yourself, the above must sound over the top. You'd prefer to deny or soften the reality of the addiction.Yet, if we're going to think clearly about the right-wing juggernaut's use of religion, and not function as its enablers, we must realize that we're dealing with an addict. Right-wing political-religious fundamentalism can destroy us too if we're like the dependent spouse who protects, defends, and covers up for the family drunk.So, what can we do to protect ourselves, maintain our sanity, promote a healthy alternative, and confront religious addiction? What's the closest thing to an intervention when we're dealing with the advanced, destructive form of religious addiction that's become culturally dominant?It takes massive inner strength and a good self-concept. There's no place for codependency and the need to be liked or affirmed by the person with the addiction. ALANON knows that. It requires clarity of purpose, freedom from the need to fix the addict, and doing what maintains one's own health and safety.Addicts reinforce each other. Fundamentalist religious organizations and media are their supportive co-users. So the person who deals with someone's addiction cannot do it alone. They must have support from others outside the addiction.You can't argue with an addict. Arguing religion to one so addicted plays into the addictive game. Arguing about the Bible or tradition is like arguing with the alcoholic about whether whiskey or tequila is better for them. It's useless and affirms the addiction.You can't buy into the addict's view of reality. Addicts cover their addiction with a mythology about the world and with language that mystifies. This means we must never use their language.Never say, even to reject it or with "so-called" before it: "partial-birth abortion," "gay rights," "intelligent design," "gay marriage," etc. Speak clearly in terms of what you believe it really is. Say "a seldom used late-term procedure," "equal rights for all," "creationist ideology," "marriage equality."Don't let the addict get you off topic. Addicts love to confuse the issues, get you talking about things that don't challenge their problem. When you do, you further the addiction.Never argue about whether sexual orientation is a choice. It doesn't matter.Never argue about sex. Our country is too sick to deal with its sexual problems.It's okay to affirm that you don't care or these aren't the issues. You don't need to justify your beliefs to a drunk or druggie.Get your message on target and repeat it. Get support for your message from others so that they're on the same page. Make it short, simple, to the point, and consistent.Don't nag addicts. Don't speak belligerently or as if you have to defend yourself. Just say: The government and other people have no right to tell someone whom to love.Don't accept that the addiction needs equal time. Stop debating as if there are two sides. Get over any guilt about a free country requiring you to make space for addictive arguments. You don't have to act as if here are "two sides" to the debate. Addicts and their dealers already have the power of the addiction and addictive communities behind their messages.Model what it is to be a healthy human being without the addiction. Addicts must see people living outside the addiction, happy, confident, proud, and free from the effects of the disease. In spite of the fact that we're a nation that supports both substance and process addictions so people don't threaten the institutions and values that pursue profits over humanity, live as if that has no ultimate control over you.Don't believe that you, your friends, children, relationships, hopes, and dreams, are any less valuable or legitimate because they aren't sanctioned by a government, politicians, or religious leaders that are in a coping, rather than healing, mode of life.Dealing with addictions takes an emotional toll on everyone. Yet, recognizing religious addiction as an addiction demystifies its dynamics and maintains our sanity.?The Fairness Project, February 2, 2005.May be reprinted in full with full credit (such as a link to this site) and notification of The Fairness Project.http://www.fairnessproject.org/Religious_Addiction.html

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In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
Jezebel Rising
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(Date Posted:03/23/2006 9:00 PM)

BRAVO, Snakechic.



As the months wore by, I noticed the very same phenomenon that the article describes. One guy in particular had to plan everything in his life in accordance to the Bible, down to the very last detail. Yes, this is the same guy who told his then-girlfirend "the Holy Spirit told me you had bad character." All that came out of his mouth was John this and Epheisians that, and he definitely was not alone in my former church. I can't be angry at him, he had a sad life. His parents don't give a damn about him (they just view him and his siblings as unpaid labor), not to mention his nitwit father (one of the co-founders of BET) left him alone in the company of Michael Jackson when he was little. I get upset just thinking about it. I once considered going out with him and marrying him jsut to get him away from that horrible environment. The girl he's going out with now is exactly the same way. Whenever people like that at my former church reveal to me the naggin issues in their lives that are eating them up inside, they then counter with a biblical injunction to make themselves feel better. They just use the Bible to make their problems go away, except those issues never retreat far from the surface.

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"I"m not a witch, but I wish I was. If I live I"d be a witch now after what they have done. I"ll burn their crops and kill their animals. I"ll stir up such storms. I"ll scatter their ships across the world. If I could meet with the devil right now, I would give him anything for power, for he is the only way to power for women in this world. I shouldn"t have been afraid of Ellen, I should have learnt. Oh, if I only had magic, I"d make them feel it."

Caryl Churchill, "Vinegar Tom"

"It might be the greatest thing ever invented, but if it"s invented, then it"s not worth dying for."

Taj Bachmann, former missionary
snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/26/2006 3:06 AM)

Thanks Justine, nice of you to give encouragement


Yeah..I've seen the same thing....."They just use the Bible to make their problems go away, except those issues never retreat far from the surface.".  My mother used to retreat into the bible...she'd spend hours and hours studying and reading  it. I don't know how many hours or years of her  life she  used up doing  it........I think its the same as being addicted to booze except it seems more 'socially acceptable'.............the end results are the same - lack of worthwhile connection to the world and people in it.


SOmetimes I think  my time online is  a complete waste of time...*shrugs*.....anyway. back to that article ......one thing I know is a waste of life -time - effort - energy....is debating with christians about theology. To me its nothing more that feeding an addiction.


I will not do it anymore - it makes me sick and achieves nothing. The article help me affirm that for myself......(again) SOme chatroom's exist for that main purpose......how much debunking do you need before its enough?


  I also wonder about the 'healing' power of debating for ex christians or people who leave one form of christianity to join another....whether that's just more of the same 'addiction'.....I don't know and I don't really care right now...

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In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
The Collective
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(Date Posted:03/26/2006 5:22 AM)

Heh..... weird.



We were taught in bibble college that we are all designed to be 'addicted' to g0d (that old g0d shaped hole again) and we are supposed to be addicted to worshipping him, and therefore all addictions are an attempt to fill that void with something else.



We were taught that because of this, it is impossible to ever overcome an addiction, to get rid of an addiction, we can only replace one addiction with another, till we finally find the right thing to be addicted to (ie. g0d) that is designed to fill that hole and fill all our needs, desires, cravings etc.



There were even xian songs about it..... eg Carman's "addicted to j*s*s" etc



Which is of course, a 'hole' load of shit..... and we actually bought into this crap and believed it totally (and some of us still do on some level)



Remembering all this makes us feel all dirty..... ugh [isgusted;]



*sigh*
Voltaire
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(Date Posted:03/26/2006 7:14 PM)


We were taught in bibble college that we are all designed to be 'addicted' to g0d





This is really sick. They obviously wanted to keep you psychologically sick and thought it was a good thing. Even worse they were so bold about it that they were completely open about it.




(that old g0d shaped hole again)





I took off all my clothes last night and looked all over my body for a g0d shaped hole and couldn't find one. So I asked g0d where my god shaped hole was and he told me since I was such an obnoxious cantankerous atheist that I didn't have one anymore. He had closed it up. Praise the Lard I've been healed!

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Zombies, Unicorns, Devils, Sea Monsters, Satyrs, Dragons, Six Winged Angels, Gods, Demons, Witches, Astrologers, A walking & talking snake, Magical fruit, Talking donkeys, human headed six-winged beasts, Ghosts. All that stuff is in the Bible and yet they tell me it"s not mythology?
snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/27/2006 12:06 AM)



Heh..... weird.We were taught in bibble college that we are all designed to be 'addicted' to g0d (that old g0d shaped hole again) and we are supposed to be addicted to worshipping him, and therefore all addictions are an attempt to fill that void with something else.We were taught that because of this, it is impossible to ever overcome an addiction, to get rid of an addiction, we can only replace one addiction with another, till we finally find the right thing to be addicted to (ie. g0d) that is designed to fill that hole and fill all our needs, desires, cravings etc.There were even xian songs about it..... eg Carman's "addicted to j*s*s" etcWhich is of course, a 'hole' load of shit.....


Farfucking out TC....


Everytime I read something like that I'm  gobsmacked!.............Our chrisitan representatives (sarcasm...) and teacher's don't have any problems using the evil heathen pyschology on their students when they want to......and of course  later  refer to it as 'devil's words'?


Do you recon they secretly read 'pop' pyschology books on the side.? That stuff about 'addiction's" and replacing one with another is pretty standard and its very deceiptful and cunning of your old bible college teacher's to use it against you all.!!!!


I guess...its also a 'truism'..........some people are easily  habituated?.........jesuschrist! that pisses me off.....so yeah what they are saying is 'its okay to be addicted as long as you're addicted to what we tell you to be'...


Sheep herding!...Grrr............oh well..*shakes off that horrible feeling*



Is that gOd Hole anything like that gOd gene shit..(yep I think its crap)? I don't believe in that popular 'addictive' personality theory either which is often used on 'addict's' to make them feel like shit.


 


 



Nearly forgot!!!





I was such an obnoxious cantankerous atheist




Haha...I can relate to that Volt-   I revel in it thou'.....I'm proud to be ABRASIVE!  and praise the Lawdalmighty that my "hole' hasn't closed up but that I can use it for 'evile'.....err  or shit.

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In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/27/2006 1:08 AM)

--------------------------------------------------------------
In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
The Collective
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(Date Posted:03/27/2006 6:44 AM)

Reply to : snakechic




Do you recon they secretly read 'pop' pyschology books on the side.? That stuff about 'addiction's" and replacing one with another is pretty standard and its very deceiptful and cunning of your old bible college teacher's to use it against you all.!!!!





This was a course in bibble college on "biblical counselling", taught by a guy who had just spent several years studying under good old Larry Crabbe in America. We started out by studying the typical secular psychology textbooks, learning about all the different secular viewpoints and psychological models. We were then led through the process of tearing them all to shreds, finding all the holes, all the flaws, and a great emphasis was put on the 'none of them take sin into account' crap.



The end result, we were taught how to brainwash people. How to break people down to their core in 'counselling sessions' till they were totally exposed and vulnerable, how to reprogram all their core beliefs to be based on g0d and the bibble etc, and how to rebuild them back up into 'good xian people' (was strange seeing the exact process of what was done to us). The classes were all about being aware of a person's psychological thought process and how to totally manipulate it. And it was all done with joy and enthusiasm.



We had to have weekly 'counselling sessions' from this guy as a condition of our entry into bibble college, and this is the same guy that jumped up in a fit of rage and very nearly punched us out during our second 'session' because we dared to disagree with something he'd said in our first session.



oh boy.... what a guy



Anyway..... can't talk about this anymore atm..... hard dredging all this stuff up again



snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/29/2006 2:55 AM)

Reply to : The Collective


We had to have weekly 'counselling sessions' from this guy as a condition of our entry into bibble college, and this is the same guy that jumped up in a fit of rage and very nearly punched us out during our second 'session' because we dared to disagree with something he'd said in our first session


WHOOwA......fuckme! that sound horrible -  to gain  'special' attention from a man like that ...and being in a system so .....I don't know what to call it.....sinister I suppose. Its all very very unethical and people  - counsellor's- of that caliber should get the book thrown at them for teaching other's such a crap 'counselling' method - or as you describe it - manipulation.


I don't know who "good old Larry Crabbe" is but i"m going to look it up later.......


there's so much I don't know  ......in a way I'm grateful for that........my shit was bad enough but I"m sad to read that other's like yourself have gone through heaps more ..........................I think any contact with 'fundamentalism'  - I mean the rough stuff like penticostalism or bibble colleges/education described is sick making!!!


Anyway.......what you describe about the college refering  or "  learning about all the different secular viewpoints and psychological models"........is a great example of the 'believer's' themselves not believing that 'faith' or christianity isn't enough!


I don't know...jesusfuckingchrist...people like that are mongrels!


Pardon me...I'm having one of my swearing days!

--------------------------------------------------------------
In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
snakechic
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(Date Posted:03/29/2006 3:04 AM)

Oh yeah......on a slightly different bent...........we've have a cyclone hit the North of Queensland last week....billions of $ damage. (no deaths)


Anyway....I heard on the news that the fucking scientologists are sending up teams and teams of 'special' counsellor's to tend to the trauma of it all..............can you image that ......and the mumbojumbo kinda 'therapy' they offer...cleansing yer chakras and aura building crap while the poor sod is laying flat out on some white sheet on a 'counselling' table.


Farfuckingout!...and the government approves because they know damn well the State doesn't have enough social services to spare in any kind of emergency let alone for day to day needs of the mental health of the community - any community ! let alone one that's so isolated!!!!!


shall we pray about it?.....*massive amounts of sarcasm*

--------------------------------------------------------------
In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.

-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God