What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness?

This is a support forum for those who have left
or are in the process of leaving fundamentalist Christianity
Current Forum Since June 2001

Walk Away from Fundamentalism

Make a donation click here. Your support will help us remove ads and upload local images, etc.

Title: What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness?

Walk Away from Fundamentalism ┗ Discussion Related to Walking Away from Fundamentalism ┗ Support Forum	Hop to:

<<Previous ThreadNext Thread>>

Page 3 / 4

<< Prev

Next >>

Author

Comment

aeroz	61#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 00:49:40) Reply to : Lahl The WORST lies?.......1) That I was an abhorrent abomination that deserved death, but that 'god' would 'heal' me if I only repented of my affliction (how exactly do you do that?) and ask for forgiveness and healing, then I would be 'healed' 2) That I WAS healed, cured, and proof of the miracles of 'god', and not brainwashed into total submission and denial and servitude 3) That all the suffering and abuse I suffered at the hands of the church, xians etc who stripped me of everything I had, coldly, deliberately and efficiently in a single day, was MY OWN FAULT, for not submitting to 'god's healing' in every way. Number 1 is a huge one. I completely disagree that anyone is worth eternal punishment of the worst kind. Number 3: wow, it seems like you got too close to a group of fundies and got burned. Have you ever told that story in another thread somewhere? I'd like to read about it. -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

Support us	Create free forum and click the links below and your donations will make a difference here.
	www.dinodirect.com Online Huge Store for Various Cool Gadgets, Nintendo Wii Controller, iPod Charger, iPhone Cases, BlackBerry Cases, Laptop Accessories, Rechargeable Battery, LED Tactical Flashlight, iPod Earphones, iPhone Charger, Wii Controller, iPod Cables, Video Players, Music Players, Car Accessories, Cell Phone Accessories, Video Games Accessories and Hobby Gadgets. If you use the code "DDLIFE", all orders will get 10% discount plus worldwide free shipping!

aeroz	62#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 00:59:15) Reply to : RadioOne Reply to : aerozYeah, I scared/forced myself into believing that one too. It was somewhat fustrating to me at the time I tell you, especially as I sat through Earth Science class. I can't tell you how overjoyed I am to be here in this forum. Everyone here understands each other; we can all relate. Everywhere else I go online or off when I try to explain these things, people just don't get it. They wonder what's "wrong" with me. They just don't understand where I am coming from. But yeah, back to your post. I know what you mean. When I was a young earth creationist and in science classes I cringed every time I sat through a lecture in which the age of the earth or origins was discussed. In English 101 the textbook called the creation story a myth. I was fuming angry. All that quarter I went into depression, bad depression. I hated the class. The textbook was also ridiculing fundies about their positions on homosexuality and other topics. I am ashamed of my behavior in that class; I once met with the instructor to discuss my disapproval of the bias of her textbook concerning homosexuality. I am slapping myself to this day. I can understand your frustration. I remember the frustration--the anger--I felt as a fundie and young earther. I sat there and assumed that my instructor was an arrogant fool trying to brainwash the class. But it was just the opposite--I had been brainwashed in the cult of fundamentalism. I remember the internal wars I was waging at the time. I "knew " that I was right and everyone else was wrong. All the science classes (Astronomy, biology, geology, physics, chemistry, paleontology, etc.) were erroneous. But I remember the nagging doubt in the back of my mind that I suppressed--the doubt that caused me so much fear and anxiety and worry. It ate away at my soul. By the time I left fundamentalism, I had nearly drowned in it. -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

aeroz	63#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 01:08:28) Actually, now that I think about it, the biggest lie that was told to me was the the Bible was 100% absolute, inerrant, perfect literal truth, completely free from error, even copyist errors. Because that's the root from which all the other branches of the fundamentalism I experienced, sprang--including the young earth thing. -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

aeroz	64#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 01:19:22) Reply to : bakagaijin When those other christians told me they were my friends, i think that was the worst lie i was told.Friends only as long as i conformed to thier ideas. Once i stepped out of the norms even a little bit, people turned their back on me.That truth is black and white and there is no room for interpretation, that was pretty bad too. "Truth is black and white," etc. I know, I know. Wow I love this place. That reminds me of something my fundie dad told me when I was talking with him about gender issues and the church. I said that I didn't like the church we were going to, and one of the reasons was that they were too conservative on their positions about women. He shook his head, did the one facial expression, and said, nope, I'm afraid that it's straightforward what "God says" about women. There is absolutely no room, not one micromillimeter, for a change or a re-interpretation or questioning. As a side-note, he also believes that global warming is a conspiracy and that...ok, get this...the cause of any warming is actually.........heat radiating from................................side-walks. Shortly before, I had found out for the first time that my dad didn't vote for women unless they were more right-wing than the other men running. I found this out at age 19. I asked him about it, and he said it was because women don't stand up for "values" as strongly as men do. They waver. They cave into political pressure before men do. In other words, they're weaker. He also meant that they are too open-minded, which, to him, is a bad thing. This really is revealing a lot to me. One of the reasons I still fear that maybe women are indeed inferior to men, is my dad and his positions, and the things he has said to me all my life about gender issues. -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

aeroz	65#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 01:46:30) Reply to : cdolares That the Bible is inerrant - it isn't. According the much revered King James Version so highly vaunted in my circles, the earth is both flat and the center of universe. The sky is an impenetrable dome above the earth. Jesus was to come again before some of the people hearing him make the claim would die. Solomon, in parallel accounts, had both 4,000 and 40,000 stalls of horses. Etc. (I've yet to hear anyone explain just WHICH KJV is the inerrant one - the 1611, or the 1789 version with all the error corrections? I've heard claims both ways, plus comments that BOTH versions are inerrant, despite the many differences between the 2 translations.) That "people who don't believe like we do" are willful sinners, shaking their fists in the face of God, and ignoring clear teaching of the Bible. That isn't true. People, generally, take their religion at least seriously enough to believe that it is Right and Good. People aren't running around with their heart-felt beliefs, thinking at the same time that those beliefs are a cheap cover up for the One True Religion. Never minding that, the Bible tends to be vague or contradictory on many things. This includes key doctrines such as salvation (do you have to be baptized or don't you to be "saved" - do you have to have works or don't you to be "saved" and so on), so much so that it's easy to see how different people can read the Bible and see things differently without being intellectually dishonest. Call this the "black and white" lie - not everything is black and white. There's lots of gray. That the genocidal God of the Old Testament who repeatedly orders the wanton slaughter of entire populations is the same God who loved the world so much that he sent his Son to die for it. That's so severely out of whack that I can hardly grasp it, nor do I accept it as true. Something's amiss with that one. That the Bible is the preserved Word of God for man. If what God wants the world to know and believe is written in the Bible, then why is the Bible so difficult to make plain sense out of in many places? Should something so important as how we interact with God be open to interpretation, or to misinterpretation? You'd think God would make it so simple, we couldn't possibly screw it up. Why would people through the centuries spend lifetimes in dedicated religious study just to wrap their brain around the contents of the Bible (in other words, why should they have to)? The consequences for getting the Bible wrong are (apparently) eternal damnation, so if the scholars and major religious denominations who are supposed to know these things not only don't agree, but sharply disagree at many turns, where the heck does that leave the layman? As best as I can tell, I am SCREWED. Now, to be fair, I've not thrown out the Bible completely. But the lie is that the Bible is word for word, verse for verse, chapter for chapter the inspired Holy Word of God. It's something...but I don't know just what it is at this point. YOU MUST HAVE COME FROM THE CHURCH I USED TO GO TO!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tell me, was it in WA state?????????????? -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

bornagainbikergirl	66#
Rank:none Score:5 Posts:5 Registered:06/26/2003 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 04:34:39) What were the worst lies they told YOU? and, DID jesus fill the emptiness? Good grief, where do I start!!!! Here are a few.... 1) Famous quote used at EVERY church function - Jesus loves you, and (get this) so do I. (gag a maggot) I wish I had a dollar for everytime I had that spoken to my face. Never mind the dagger I got in the back later if I did not walk the "straight and narrow." 2) It is a sin to wear jewelry. After all, Satan wanted to outshine the glory of God, so therefore, If we (namely, women) wear jewelry we are acting as agents of Satan, because (gasp!!) jewelry is shiny. Hey, I kid you not!! 3) it is a sin for a woman to cut her hair. A woman's hair is her glory and is a kind of "spiritual covering". It is used as a weapon in spiritual warfare. Evil spirits can get into the "spiritual backdoor" of a family if the woman cuts her hair. Never mind that the man as the " spiritual head of the household" could be an arrogant son of a bitch. Women are always "the bad guy". No pun intended of course. 4) Women are not supposed to wear pants. "things of the man are not of the woman" "things of the woman are not of the man". Hey dipshit, men in biblical days did not wear pants either. Especially Levis, they were not invented yet. What's up with that?!? 5) Pastors are our "spiritual fathers." Hell, no wonder the world is in such a mess. 6) Pastors are the shepherds, the church members are the sheep. I guess that is why pastors feel they have a god given right to mentally and emotionally slaughter their "flocks" 7) "I go to prepare a place for you." I guess it must be a mental facility. After all, if we do manage to survive religion, we are permanently maimed for life. 8) Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel. We must evangelize. No, leave it all for Benny Hinn to do. After all, he is a professional performer. Make him earn some of that money he milks from all of his followers. Hey, wait a minute!! He wears all kinds of fancy jewelry. Could it be that he is an agent of Satan? Man, that was a REVELATION!!!! 9) MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU!!!! Oops, wrong, I was mixing reality with fiction. Hey, I wonder if Darth Vadar is the antichrist. If he is, man, what a snazzy dresser. I am losing it. Time to go!!!! See what fundamentalism will do to a person!!!! I am diagonally parked in a parallel universe!!!! -------------------------------------------------------------- Spirituality is easier on the back of a Harley Davidson.

The Collective	67#
Rank:none Score:270 Posts:270 Registered:12/23/2001 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 04:41:10) Reply to : aeroz wow, it seems like you got too close to a group of fundies and got burned. Have you ever told that story in another thread somewhere? I'd like to read about it. No. It was not a 'group of fundies' that burned me. It was, and still is, xianity on the whole. My story has been told many times here since I first joined 3 1/2 years ago. Unfortunately, many of the threads have disappeared into the oblivion of lost archives. Tho you will still find many 'parts' of my story in different threads. Its a little too complicated to tell in just a few sentances, just know that its extremely complicated, intertwined with other issues that most people wouldn't have a clue about, so its hard to get into an explanation without being cryptic about a lot of things, or getting too involved in explaining everything and going on and on and on. Kinda embarrassed to keep retelling it, cos I think that everyone thats already heard it before is going to get sick of hearing about it and tell me to shut up lol As for all the creationist/6000 year old earth crap, I was totally brainwashed by all that too. Its taken a long time to get my head around whats real science, but it all came down to having to relearn everything, and try to ignore the programming trying to tell you that what you're learning is lies etc etc. There was a lot of pseudo-scientific bullshit that the creationist use, and that confused me as it was very convincing, and you really need to directly look at the real scientific evidence that addresses those issues. As Yoda once said...... "you must unlearn what you have learned" Lahl

snakechic	68#
Rank:none Score:3587 Posts:3587 Registered:11/02/2004 Time spent: 6158 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 05:51:05) Reply to : bornagainbikergirl . (gag a maggot) I love that......I'm a collector of sayings' Yeah ditto to all that -females copped it -what a deal for the males in the church, immediate superiority and in some cases don't like to leave that little perk behind -- did you go to the SDA's? no matter its all very familiar and stock standard except that last bit After all, if we do manage to survive religion, we are permanently maimed for life. yeah sad. I'd say 'changed' and for me adding a certain healthy skeptism towards all religion for my future life. Never again! Bikergirl! Remember thos magic slates we had as kids. If you didn't like what you had drawn, you had only to pull the top sheet up and it would disappear? But....the line stayed on the black stuff underneath forever. - thats a metaphor for the interaction conscious an unconscious mind. ......and to me the best way to see 'permanently mained'. ? Ever heard of a 'water bottle'? Reply to Lahl "you must unlearn what you have learned" When I read that I felt like I was reading 'you must unclean what you have cleaned'...........silly me I flipped into the SDA's mind - that's all I seemed to hear....unclean this unclean that, un....bloody belivabubble -------------------------------------------------------------- In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation. -- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God

RadioOne	69#
Registered:07/18/2004 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 06:46:13) Reply to : Lahl As Yoda once said...... "you must unlearn what you have learned" That's exactly what I did when I dove into the Fundamentalist pit in the first place. The whole deal about Hell literally being in the center of the Earth also drove me nuts during Earth Science when learning about the interior of the Earth. I would become depressed thinking about all the people in there. I would also wonder how a place could be literally there even though the core of the Earth is confirmed to be solid because only certain seismic waves can go through. I eventually made up some odd deal about cross-demensional (I really don't know...) stuff to rectify something that is supposedly on the spiritual plane (I say this because of the "spiritual bodies" people are supposed to have after death) being on this plane of existance. The explanation I had was probably weird and based on pure conjecture of the little bit I have learned about other demensions, so it may not make any sense. I do not think I will post it because it was probably so outlandish. It was odd indeed. -------------------------------------------------------------- "You must remember yourself--be acutely aware of yourself being present to yourself in this point in time." --Dr. Quentin Dinardo, professor

aeroz	70#
Rank:none Score:35 Posts:35 Registered:05/23/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 08:13:04) Reply to : RadioOne That's exactly what I did when I dove into the Fundamentalist pit in the first place.The whole deal about Hell literally being in the center of the Earth also drove me nuts during Earth Science when learning about the interior of the Earth. Ohhh, my god that is just too funny... I would become depressed thinking about all the people in there. I would also wonder how a place could be literally there even though the core of the Earth is confirmed to be solid because only certain seismic waves can go through. I guess it isn't really that funny after all. You know what? I never thought about that one. Not really. But I was never convinced in my fundamentalism that hell was in the center of the earth. What a bunch of crap. Pure crap. Hello, null-brained fundie preachers! The center of the earth is too small! I eventually made up some odd deal about cross-demensional (I really don't know...) stuff to rectify something that is supposedly on the spiritual plane You'd have to do that for everything. When you combine fundie doctrine with real science, you have to add stuff to the picture that you cannot show to be there. -------------------------------------------------------------- I saw this site, and I knew immediately that I was home.

jmassi	71#
Rank:none Score:111 Posts:111 Registered:09/19/2004 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 11:44:26) The most damaging thing I was ever told was that Christian young people should not date young people from broken homes because we were more likely to divorce. It was said several times in class at Bob Jones University, by several different people. It devastated me because I had come from the family from Hell, and my folks had split in a tremendously prolonged, bitter, violent divorce. Yes, I would have to say that Jesus did fill the gap. When I was crying about it one day, this elderly lady at the school who was very kind and very much respected told me that in Christ we are new creatures, and anybody who said that we had to be subject to our past to that degree just didn't know the power of Christ to keep us. She quoted some Scripture to me about the Lord Jesus being our righteousness, and overcoming all things by faith. I realized that some Fundamentalists are full of crap. I accepted that (at last!) It certainly helped when she told me that she also came from an incredibly unhappy and violent childhood home. I went right up to the last person who had made that stupid proclamation about children from broken homes and told her that the conclusion was faithless and unbiblical and quoted back to her the same verses I'd just been given. It just dumbfounded her, and she apologized. I realize that a lot of people here don't believe the Bible, and I'm not going to try to persuade you otherwise. But I'll tell you this, you can defeat Fundamentalists at their own game most of the time. A lot of the crap they teach does not come from Scripture. And most people who claim to be Fundamentalists don't; even know what's in the Bible. They just repeat what a dogmatic preacher has told them. -------------------------------------------------------------- Blog on the Lillypad http://www.jeriwho.net/lillypad2/blogger.htm Recovering Fundamentalists Podcast: http://www.jeriwho.net/podcast/blogger.html

RadioOne	72#
Registered:07/18/2004 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 20:49:07) Good for you, jmassi! It's nice to hear that some progress was made. I would also like to say that having faith in Jesus has helped me. I have OCD (Scrupulosity, to be exact), but faith has really helped apart from everthing else that I am supposed to be doing in coping with the problem. That's what has helped me, but it would be wrong for me to force this on anyone else. To aeroz: Do not worry about laughing about my former beliefs about Hell. It's strange indeed. -------------------------------------------------------------- "You must remember yourself--be acutely aware of yourself being present to yourself in this point in time." --Dr. Quentin Dinardo, professor

AthenaMarina	73#
Registered:08/22/2003 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:05/26/2005 21:33:34) Hi all! Firstly, re. Biker Girls "worst lies" she was told: 1) Famous quote used at EVERY church function - Jesus loves you, and (get this) so do I. (gag a maggot) I wish I had a dollar for everytime I had that spoken to my face. Never mind the dagger I got in the back later if I did not walk the "straight and narrow." *Can totally relate. Oh yeah you LOVE me but you can't even bring yourself to smile at me and say hello cos you're too busy in your little clique!* 3) it is a sin for a woman to cut her hair. A reverse side of the coin, my dad STILL thinks that if a guy has long hair there's something wrong with him - remember, the bible says it is shameful for a man to have long hair! That's why I think there were only TWO guys in two decades of church going to a church that I saw with long hair! 4) Women are not supposed to wear pants. "things of the man are not of the woman" "things of the woman are not of the man". Hey dipshit, men in biblical days did not wear pants either. Especially Levis, they were not invented yet. What's up with that?!? Hey! Good point re the Levis! Yeah, men kinda wore dresses in that day (well, tunics!) Once in our church musical the music director and some women with him thought it might be nice to have the women wear long navy trousers and smart white shirts on stage for a change but do you know some of the congregation complained and we had to scrap that! And some people looked down on my Aunty for wearing trousers! Even though they were very smart trousers! Good on her for doing it! 8) Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel. We must evangelize. Gee did THAT one make me unpopular a couple of times! Lucky I didn't try to do it even MORE! And everything had to have a scriptural or semi pat answer! But if only those I tried to evangelise to had pointed out the contradictions in the bible and things like that rather than saying just "You're wrong" "You're narrow-minded" or "How do you KNOW there's a God?" (To which, how do you know there's NOT?! If they had done THAT I might have been a member of this forum a LLLOOOONNNGGGG time ago. One of the worst lies though for me and sorry if I have mentioned it already? was the whole Mark of the Beast thing. It got me almost wanting to kill myself at times for fear that I would be tortured or killed for not accepting the mark (whatever THAT was!) or else go to hell and burn! I mean if you KNEW how LOW my tolerance for pain is! and how much I fear rape and torture! But even the thought of hiding somewhere remote for days on end with very few creature comforts to a hedonistic, materialistic by nature (although also spiritual and generous and kind!) person like me was bad ENOUGH! *The gay lie is ridiculous, what do gays do to straights? Leave em ALONE!* Did Jesus fill the emptiness NO! Actually, my happiness I could grade (and many other nice emotions) in proportion to how NOT into the whole Christian thing I was. When I was at my most religious eek I was more repressed and thinking there was evil in many songs, movies etc! Fortunately that stage did not last long! I'm not saying I don't have my problems I DO! But I don't have to think oh maybe God will help me but maybe it's not in his will for such and such to happen, maybe I shouldn't even WANT it to! THAT was one of the worst lies for me as WELL! That whole, "something is missing thing" those who are not saved are supposed to feel? I always felt that when I WAS a Christian! Now I'm not one and I am free to pick and choose bits and pieces of any or none spiritual or religious belief and I am happily married (to a non Christian!) and I live in another country and sometimes enjoy travel I am happier! Radio One, if it's helped you though I am pleased here that and pleased to hear you don't want to force it on anyone! I personally now believe there are different spiritual/religious/humanistic-atheist paths people can choose and they can be good for certain people sure but forcing them on others is wrong. However, I kinda can also relate to SnakeChick's thing about being a bit skeptical of religions and things now too! Good for you, jmassi! It's nice to hear that some progress was made.I would also like to say that having faith in Jesus has helped me. I have OCD (Scrupulosity, to be exact), but faith has really helped apart from everthing else that I am supposed to be doing in coping with the problem. That's what has helped me, but it would be wrong for me to force this on anyone else.To aerozo not worry about laughing about my former beliefs about Hell. It's strange indeed. -------------------------------------------------------------- Yes I AM too cool for church! Jesus is NOT waaay cool I AM! Am I"m real and he"s NOT SO...! I used to be into Jesus But now I"ve kicked the habit Now I have REALLY seen "the light" and know the REAL truth and the Truth - not the lie of christianity! - has set me free! "..When you"re inside the pig, it"s so warm and comfortable and feels wonderful. Then you get out and you realise the hideous monster that"s been accomodating you!" (From a book, talking about during and after bad relationships but SO appropriate here too!)

poonis	74#
Rank:none Score:18 Posts:18 Registered:05/26/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:06/10/2005 05:11:01) The greatest lies I've been told by the church: 1. God exists. 2. The Bible is true. Every other lie is built on these assumptions. There is no more core and fundamental lie they can tell anyone. -------------------------------------------------------------- "Mankind shall never be free until the last king is strangled in the entrails of the last priest." -Dennis Diderot, father of the Encyclopaedia, in Dithyrambe Sur La Fête Des Rois If I had the choice of first existing in an afterlife, and second of where I would go, I would prefer to exist, but I would prefer to go where there is not to be found any king, any pope, any priest, pastor, bishop, reverend, deacon, rabbi, nun, televangelist, sooth-sayer, bible-thumper, fundamentalist, extremist, zionist, nor any member of any religion, denomination, sect, or church whatsoever. Call it what you will. This, to me, is heaven. - Me.

Kiera	75#
Rank:none Score:13 Posts:13 Registered:09/21/2001 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:06/12/2005 12:32:04) That demons exist That they can travel down family lines That they can get to you through 'soul ties' That I had them from my family, from the soul ties I had with the man who raped me and from my general spirit of rebellion. That there was no need for a christian to be depressed and that it was an offense before God That I could be healed if I had enough faith Great question - made me feel a bit sick though.

RadioOne	76#
Registered:07/18/2004 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:06/12/2005 18:27:04) Reply to : Kiera That demons existThat they can travel down family linesThat they can get to you through 'soul ties'That I had them from my family, from the soul ties I had with the man who raped me and from my general spirit of rebellion.That there was no need for a christian to be depressed and that it was an offense before GodThat I could be healed if I had enough faithGreat question - made me feel a bit sick though. The teachings about demons going down through family lines and demons through "soul ties" (especially from someone who has raped you) sound abusive at best. I do not know about the rest, but that is just my opinion. It sounds like the teachers of your faith were trying to control you. Hug Welcome to the forum. -------------------------------------------------------------- "You must remember yourself--be acutely aware of yourself being present to yourself in this point in time." --Dr. Quentin Dinardo, professor

Voltaire	77#
Rank:none Score:1490 Posts:1490 Registered:07/08/2001 Time spent: 15377 hours	(Date Posted:06/12/2005 19:34:50) That demons exist Quite so. this is one of the most horrid things I was taught also. After I became an atheist I realized I was actually more afraid of Satan and his demons than I was afraid of god. At least god waits to punish you, while Satan get you RIGHT NOW and possess you. Great question - made me feel a bit sick though. So much for the "peace that passeth understanding..." -------------------------------------------------------------- Zombies, Unicorns, Devils, Sea Monsters, Satyrs, Dragons, Six Winged Angels, Gods, Demons, Witches, Astrologers, A walking & talking snake, Magical fruit, Talking donkeys, human headed six-winged beasts, Ghosts. All that stuff is in the Bible and yet they tell me it"s not mythology?

Wolvertique	78#
Rank:none Score:28 Posts:28 Registered:06/09/2005 Time spent: 0 hours	(Date Posted:06/13/2005 16:56:44) 1. That the God of the Bible was love. 2. That anyone who wasn't a conservative (theologically, though most of them expected political conservatism as well) Christian was going to hell. 3. That one on one direct evangelism was necessary. I absolutely hated trying to tell others about my religious beliefs in order to get them to convert. 4. That daily, scheduled, and IMO boring "quiet times" were required every day, and if you objected to them, you didn't love the Bible or God. 5. If someone comes to you for help, throw Bible quotes at them rather than sympathy. Yes, actually, Jesus was a great comfort, and I have never stopped believing in God. I just stopped believing that the ignorant, wrath-filled humans who wrote the Bible knew anything about God.

AthenaMarina	79#
Registered:08/22/2003 Time spent: 0 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/23/2008 13:48:42) I don't know if I mentioned this one? That gays CHOOSE to be gay. And that they're NOT born like that. You know when i found out about hermaphrodites I felt confused like HOW THE HELL could it be so black and white as that? Plus my best friend in NZ said to me one day how everyone ostracised him (sp?) at a party once cos he is gay (wish I'D been there!) and he said so sadly "I can't believe how people think I would CHOOSE to be gay." He is really lovely and happy in his sexuality what I think he meant was to be you know the minority. And some gay people go through WAY worse than that - like abuse! Another lie is about how wonderful the Bible is. The bible is SO full of HOLES baby! When I found that out it's the biggest reason I walked away even though i'd wanted to for years! And how God has a plan for you. Well now I think I have a plan for me. I still believe in a higher power but I CERTAINLY DON'T use the word "God" in this as it is so tainted to me now! But I believe that I get to choose a lot of my life. I put things on hold or sabotaged them before because I thought maybe God WANTED me to lose a job or a relationship! NOT ANYMORE! -------------------------------------------------------------- Yes I AM too cool for church! Jesus is NOT waaay cool I AM! Am I"m real and he"s NOT SO...! I used to be into Jesus But now I"ve kicked the habit Now I have REALLY seen "the light" and know the REAL truth and the Truth - not the lie of christianity! - has set me free! "..When you"re inside the pig, it"s so warm and comfortable and feels wonderful. Then you get out and you realise the hideous monster that"s been accomodating you!" (From a book, talking about during and after bad relationships but SO appropriate here too!)

AthenaMarina	80#
Registered:08/22/2003 Time spent: 0 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/23/2008 13:56:59) Then there was that whole lie that if you are a GOOD little virgin till married boy or girl and don't date non Christians God will bring you THE ONE who will be a CHRISTIAN and be the most WONDERFUL person for you! Honey, I know people in their 30s and 40s who WANT to find somone who are still UNhappily single and waiting on God to deliver the goods! (Nothing wrong with being single of course but these are people who DON'T want to be! One of them goes through depression because of it and cries, another wants to kill herself - I'd help her snap out of THAT but she says the only reason she wants to be alive sometimes is cos she's scared of hell!) And then there are people like me who decide somewhere along the way STUFF this virginity and not dating non Christians thing and have sex and date non Christians and then end up married to a non Christian they just adore! And sometimes to Christians! SO THAT was BULLSHIT TOO! Then there are those like one of my cousins, marry young, Christian man. Years later he ditches her no apparent reason (she's great got it all!) and then later on she marries a guy who's not a Christian (maybe even an atheist, not sure) and they're really happy together! -------------------------------------------------------------- Yes I AM too cool for church! Jesus is NOT waaay cool I AM! Am I"m real and he"s NOT SO...! I used to be into Jesus But now I"ve kicked the habit Now I have REALLY seen "the light" and know the REAL truth and the Truth - not the lie of christianity! - has set me free! "..When you"re inside the pig, it"s so warm and comfortable and feels wonderful. Then you get out and you realise the hideous monster that"s been accomodating you!" (From a book, talking about during and after bad relationships but SO appropriate here too!)

Guest
	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/23/2008 15:01:20) I've missed out on possible long term relationships (and maybe even marriage) as I had some great non-christian boyfriends when I was a fundy which I gave up in the search for the elusive christian man with leadership potential or when people in church discovered I was with a non-christian boyfriend. Also I didn't have my priorities right as a fundy so even if dating and marrying non christian men was tolerated or accepted I would have seen easy going men as weak and passive as I believed that they should be the ones making the decisions. So anyone who was a tad disorganised in arranging dates would have been passed on whereas now I don't see that as a fault as I would take over the role of finding out information on whats going on. There's the secular equivalent of waiting for the perfect christian partner ordained by God and that's the erroneous belief that there is the perfect person out there for all of us which is simply not true. There is no such thing as the perfect partner only several nearly right ones if you're lucky and have worked on yourself and if you're an arsehole then there is no-one right for you at all other than a masochist.

snakechic	82#
Rank:none Score:3587 Posts:3587 Registered:11/02/2004 Time spent: 6158 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/23/2008 19:24:10) yep... always strikes me as being quite 'arrogant' to expect to find someone who is perfect..........100% fit - (are you perfect yourself) and if you strike out...its easy to blame yourself but more often than not ..its got nothing to do with you or what 'you're' done... again.. to think you are the centre of the universe is a bit 'arrogant'..... "if you're an arsehole then there is no-one right for you at all other than a masochist." Is that like saying 'you made your bed so go lie in it"? everyone comes into a relationship with their own baggage...'you' don't attract or deserve arseholes..sometimes its just happens or 'you' simply made a mistake.. no big deal or reflection on 'self'.. bit like the woman who gets involved with a 'serial killer'....not her fault HE choose to do that..or that he choose to hide that from his partner... Ya can't control everything that happens ? (Message edited by snakechic On 02/23/2008 20:13:34) -------------------------------------------------------------- In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation. -- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God

Chirpy	83#
Registered:03/06/2003 Time spent: 0 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/24/2008 05:20:04) Snakechic it was me who placed the above post as Aimoo tends to let us in when we think we've logged in but actually haven't. I really hate this attitude there's a Mr Right or Miss Right out there for everyone and maybe I didn't explain this properly. In reality finding mates is more of a chaotic thing and we meet people where we are and try to muddle along. What about people brought up in isolated villages around a hundred years ago? They didn't go searching round the world looking for that special someone. They would often end up marrying the girl or boy next door figuratively speaking and it worked out in a way as there was little in the way of outside temptation. Also if you grow up in the same place with little outside influences from media, travel, etc you're probably going to be of the same mindset. There's this new age psychobabble thing that women attract bad men deliberately and keep making the same mistakes over and over again as they are caught up in negative patterns. I'm at the moment seeing the futility of this argument. I seem to attract heavy drinkers and drug addicts and that's because binge drinking and taking drugs is rife in the city where I live. Is it always my fault. Alcoholics are very good at disguising their habit and with my experiences with them I'm getting to recognise the warning signs. Women date bad guys because they don't appear so 'bad' on the surface just exciting. It's only later on that things tend to surface. In fact some of them masquerade as nice ordinary caring men and not adventurous types at all. This psychobabble attitude or desiring or deliberately seeking out wife beaters/alcoholics/drug addicts is just another way to blame the woman. I guess it's difficult to find out about somebody's past or secret life because we don't live in self contained villages any more but in urban areas with much coming and going. I could place a personal ad looking for a potential partner who drinks alcohol sensibly if at all and stays away from street drugs but would that work? People lie. and if you strike out...its easy to blame yourself but more often than not ..its got nothing to do with you or what 'you're' done... again.. to think you are the centre of the universe is a bit 'arrogant'..... Not sure if I made myself clear here but this is the way I used to think. To give an example I was sexually harassed by a man who belonged to the same group as me a few years' ago. I blamed myself for flirting too much maybe or appearing vulnerable or being over friendly. It turned out that other women in the group were getting the same problem and we all differed from each other in terms of appearance and personality. I had to be told that it wasn't anything to do with me and that neither of us deserved it. It was going on because of the man himself and that nobody until then had bothered to check it. I guess we all have a dark side which we try to keep under wraps and it slips out if not acknowledged and recognised. Late last night the tenant in the flat downstairs invited his girlfriend back and there was a fierce fight going on for over an hour with banging of furniture and shouting and the girl constantly crying. It was only when she started screaming that neighbours intervened at which point she ran into one of the neighbour's appartments and I called the police. It was completely out of character for this man and both we the neighbours and his girlfiend could vouch for that. It turned out that he had been drinking heavily. (Message edited by Chirpy On 02/24/2008 05:39:14)

snakechic	84#
Rank:none Score:3587 Posts:3587 Registered:11/02/2004 Time spent: 6158 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/24/2008 18:02:05) Oh..I wasn't sure who was who in that post..but my reply wasn't meant personally anyway...just my thoughts in general to those ideas. ...the last bit - "if you're an arsehole then there is no-one right for you at all other than a masochist". I wasn't sure what was meant so I made something up. I guess I should have asked? The statement kinda suggests its 'deserved'. You hear that 'Mr right' crap so often....from all over the place. the other term that shits me is..'my soulmate'...? blek..it does strike me as 'arrogant'.....perhaps a better way to explain what I make of it..is that I see this attitude from people who have a high sense of entitlement..and very little clarity of what relationship are about. Its a bit like believing you can WIN ? Or that scoring a partner make you a more valuable person as well as ..its a reflection of who you are......its an 'ownership' thing. One of my acquaintances told me she puts a 'wish list' under her pillow at night and expects the universe to supply her with a 'perfect' mate. (again).. I mean....blekky...newagey shit.? I don't like her much... (& that was me being bitchy..hehehe) Yep...I see what you mean. The old stats go something like ....most people hook up at high school and most of their lifetime friends are made during that time..so naturally the people tend to have a background in common. As the person gets older it becomes harder to meet people - especially if you don't have kids. The kids are the 'common-ground'..the school activities. People are on the move more and more these days...we've moved interstate and have adult children. SO the 'friends' are made at work etc...for me thou' I have less inclination to have the heavy social life I had back 'home'. I love not being on call for stuff. Psycho babble ....Yeah..there is a lot of it around. I don't like the idea that women set out to find a shithead...but maybe some do? I don't know. I think women with low self esteem, desperate to be 'saved' from life..tend to make booboo's like hooking up with unavailable mates - married men. I think your explanation for whats happened to you is very reasonable. The most popular pass time is going to the pub, the odds are there are a fair few 'pissheads' - druggies etc around. Yep...people lie...(include xians) And one of the things to consider I guess...is that when you're falling in love ..part of that process is to 'believe' and be taken in with the emotions. Its very 'normal'..most people believe they have hit the jackpot...say they have found 'mr right' for that initial period... then reality begins to break through...(maybe) I think its probably a sensible thing to be aware of that 'high' period...to me..its probably similar to a 'spiritual experience' of falling in love. Blaming yourself.....Yep..I've done that myself. I've had to slap myself on the face a couple of times in the more recent past. I love to flirt..to be friendly...I love to wear cool, short skirts when its hot and when I'm home. So what!...that doesn't mean I'm 'catmeat' for any man that takes a fancy and wants to have sex with me. NO..that's crap isn't it. Yep...we all wear a mask too. I think its great when I can be honest with myself...and aware of myself. It doesn't happen all that much - its hard work. but...I do love to explore a 'dark side'..break rules etc...and think outside the box. I'm too old to care what people think these days. Yay... Oh..poor you. HAving to deal with that......Domestic Violence is a biggie everywhere - in all stratus of society....but this sounds like it was a one off thing with your neighbour? I guess ...to on lookers "being outrageously pissed" is scary - the person is waaay out of control, loud and could do anything. Huge problem with violence among young people - 18 - 25..........being 'glassed' at the pub & clubs. ..a few very nasty fights...all kinds of stuff. I'm not sure if its getting worse....but when I was a younger..(hehehe..don't you love that saying)...it wasn't as bad. I felt fairly safe going out with girlfriends etc..didn't bother me. ? I think as 'we' become older and older our sense of 'safety' is threatened more. ? .......btw I'm not that old..heheehe (Just as a bit of a side issue.... the stats are that 'older' people feel there is more crime in their world ..are more concerned about it..but as a group are NOT the highest age group to suffer as victims of crime...far from it. so its about a change in perception - fear/vulnerability) ? Getting back to your last post Chirpy... I think its crazy how most xian churches expect 'you' to only hook up with someone within the group!!!.....or even to score another xian from another church.. ITs so unreasonable....purely on a numbers game - the distribution of females vs. males are not equal anyway....& to believe that only xians make 'good' partners. The post makes more sense to me now I'm aware who wrote it....... As a former xian ..you had a kind of a 'prescription' of what the 'ideal' man was...what qualities to look for and to admire...now you see that its bullshit...and screwed up? I know you are less 'judgemental' of anyone who doesn't fit that tight list.... Not to mention ..the way you handled your 'Antthony' thing...was brilliant - very assertive!!! -------------------------------------------------------------- In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation. -- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God

snakechic	85#
Rank:none Score:3587 Posts:3587 Registered:11/02/2004 Time spent: 6158 hours	RE:What were the worst lies they told YOU? And, DID Jesus fill the emptiness? (Date Posted:02/24/2008 18:07:39) and .....I totally didn't see AthenaMaina recent post!...until just now..!!!! (what a twit I am)..hehehehe.. -------------------------------------------------------------- In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation. -- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God

snakechic

86#

Rank:none
Score:3587
Posts:3587
Registered:11/02/2004
Time spent: 6158 hours
snakechic is offline