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VioletsApostateSoul
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1# |
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(Date Posted:03/23/2005 22:59:25)
Reply to : PhoenixFireWalker
what lies were YOU told e.g. in church?
What lies, eh? Well, there is the sweeping everything answer, but I can get more specific than that. 
"Jesus loves you."
John 3:16. What kind of a "loving" god would create hell to send people that he loved so much to? And what kind of a "powerful" god would have to die to fix the problems that it created in the first place??? If god is timeless, couldnt he just go back to the beginning and fix it? And if he knows everything, dont you think he could have gotten it right in the first place???
"God created man in his own image." That one has to be the other way around.
Unsaved people really want you to tell them about Jesus. If they argue with you, it's Satan or his demons talking through them.
Oh... this one really burned my shorts: Confusion is from Satan. HUH??? Oh yeah... this one is to keep the sheep in line. If you tell them that their doubts are coming from Satan, then they will never voice them so that they will appear as devout as the next lamb. Sad. Sort of like the story of the Emperors new clothes, right?
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paginity2
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 01:46:51)
Lies? there were so many.
Women would be saved in childbirth (ya naughty jezebel child wantin' to avoid marriage servitude).
Jesus loves me, but GAWD wants to fry me over a cuss word.
Angels will be all agog if you go to church without a mantle.
Unsaved people are depressed and unhapy. Christians (good ones) are not.
Adults, preachers and christian leaders are caring, good and totally concerned about the sick and poor.
Everyone is welcome in church.
I'd go on but my fingers are tired.
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Fermez ta bouche et mangez tes fritures de liberté.
"Unless we each conform,
Unless we obey orders,
Unless we follow our leaders blindly;
There is no possible way we can remain free."
Major Frank Burns
"People are like glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is light from within."
-Elisabeth Kübler-Ross
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Voltaire
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3# |
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 06:09:02)
I think the worst lie of all was they claimed belief in their religion while constantly acting as if they didn't. As Nietzsche put it:
If the Christian dogmas of a revengeful God, universal sinfulness, election by divine grace and the danger of eternal damnation were true, it would be a sign of weak-mindedness and lack of character not to become a priest, apostle or hermit and, in fear and trembling, to work solely on one's own salvation; it would be senseless to lose sight of ones eternal advantage for the sake of temporal comfort. If we may assume that these things are at any rate believed true, then the everyday Christian cuts a miserable figure; he is a man who really cannot count to three, and who precisely on account of his spiritual imbecility does not deserve to be punished so harshly as Christianity promises to punish him.
from Nietzsche's Human, all too Human, s.116, R.J. Hollingdale transl.
Have you ever noticed that they keep saying they believe that stuff, but constantly act as if they didn't? And why do I think that's the worst lie? Because I was determined to not be like that. I tried very very hard to really truly believe my religion completely and thoroughly with nothing excluded. And the reason why was the same as given by Niezsche: If god is really like what the Christians claim he is then only a complete blithering idiot takes god's word lightly.
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Zombies, Unicorns, Devils, Sea Monsters, Satyrs, Dragons, Six Winged Angels, Gods, Demons, Witches, Astrologers, A walking & talking snake, Magical fruit, Talking donkeys, human headed six-winged beasts, Ghosts. All that stuff is in the Bible and yet they tell me it"s not mythology?
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snakechic
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4# |
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 08:41:34)
Mmmm.....cool question and I can't think of anything - everything is a lie?
The I'm gonna ta Hell is probably the one I heard said to me the most. That and umm...Satan is sitting on my shoulder.
Speaking in tongues....heeheeee
Healing of any kind
That christian's are always good - honest people...heeheee
The pastor is god's rep on earth that's why he owns the church building and needs to keep the money - the pastor and his church is the only true church in the whole wide world.
The christian's in 'our' church are the only true christian's and are direct descendences of Adam or some such bullshit. Jews and Muslims are not. (of course)
christian's are loving....heeheee....and pure.....and don't sin.....heehee......
fornicatin' and masterbation is bad, evil........christian's don't fuck around because its bad.
If I eat carrots I will go to heaven. Bacon will rot my soul.
Watching TV is evil and satan lives inside.
Father and Husband are the leaders and I will be taken good care of by them (if I obey)....women are sluts and harlots who don't obey.
Praying will achieve anything I want.....all I need to do is ask and I will receive.
I could go on and on but I think I've bored you all enough.
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In exchange for obedience, Christianity promises salvation in an afterlife; but in order to elicit obedience through this promise, Christianity must convince people that they need salvation, that there is something to be saved from. Christianity has nothing to offer a happy person living in a natural, intelligible universe. If Christianity is to gain a motivational foothold, it must declare war on earthly pleasure and happiness, and this, historically, has been its precise course of action. In the eyes of Christianity, woman(man) is sinful and helpless in the face of God, and is potential fuel for the flames of hell. Just as Christianity must destroy reason before it can introduce faith, so it must destroy happiness before it can introduce salvation.
-- George H Smith, Atheism: The Case Against God
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Chirpy
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 09:48:19)
The people out there (non-christians) don't give a toss about working hard.
Non-christian men don't know how to treat women, that's why in the world women aren't expected to be submissive. Christian men know how to treat women so it's safe for them to be submissive. Words to that effect.
Christians don't steal.
If you let God be the centre of your life you will have a fantastic time and be fulfilled.
Everything you need to know is in the Bible.
There's not enough to do in the city that's for families.
This list is not exhaustive. I can think of more but not at the moment. But it's almost anything you hear in a fundy church.
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Voltaire
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6# |
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 17:49:22)
Here's a few things Nietzsche had to say about the lies of Christianity:
So long as the priest, that professional denier, calumniator and poisoner of life, is accepted as a higher variety of man, there can be no answer to the question, What is truth? Truth has already been stood on its head when the obvious attorney of mere emptiness is mistaken for its representative.
-- Nietzsche, The Antichrist, section 8
Whoever has theological blood in his veins is shifty and dishonourable in all things. The pathetic thing that grows out of this condition is called faith: in other words, closing one's eyes upon one's self once for all, to avoid suffering the sight of incurable falsehood.
-- Nietzsche, The Antichrist, section 9
Whatever a theologian regards as true must be false: there you have almost a criterion of truth. His profound instinct of self-preservation stands against truth ever coming into honour in any way, or even getting stated.
-- Nietzsche, Ibid
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Zombies, Unicorns, Devils, Sea Monsters, Satyrs, Dragons, Six Winged Angels, Gods, Demons, Witches, Astrologers, A walking & talking snake, Magical fruit, Talking donkeys, human headed six-winged beasts, Ghosts. All that stuff is in the Bible and yet they tell me it"s not mythology?
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Shadowself
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7# |
Registered:
01/16/2004
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(Date Posted:03/24/2005 19:07:21)
Reply to : Voltaire
Here's a few things Nietzsche had to say about the lies of Christianity:So long as the priest, that professional denier, calumniator and poisoner of life, is accepted as a higher variety of man, there can be no answer to the question, What is truth? Truth has already been stood on its head when the obvious attorney of mere emptiness is mistaken for its representative.-- Nietzsche, The Antichrist, section 8Whoever has theological blood in his veins is shifty and dishonourable in all things. The pathetic thing that grows out of this condition is called faith: in other words, closing one's eyes upon one's self once for all, to avoid suffering the sight of incurable falsehood.-- Nietzsche, The Antichrist, section 9Whatever a theologian regards as true must be false: there you have almost a criterion of truth. His profound instinct of self-preservation stands against truth ever coming into honour in any way, or even getting stated.
-- Nietzsche, Ibid
Wow, I'm going to have to read some Nietzsche.
Most of your answers cover the first question concerning lies, to which I can only add that the entire system, if believed literally, is lies. Adam and Eve, the world flood, Elijah whipped up to heaven in a chariot, Jonah and the whale, all the healings in the NT--lies. Oh, fundy xtians don't think they are lying, but they are deceived, and spread their deception around like butter on toast.
The second part of PhoenixFireWalker's question "Did Jesus fill the emptiness?" NO. My emptiness at the time of my conversion was caused by a lack of life skills, so I felt helpless and needy, having to depend too much on people to take care of me. Such as my parents, who I really needed to instead be pulling away from and developing my own personhood. But, after much of my own study (and suspention of my critical thinking process--which wasn't in too good of shape yet anyway), Jesus "saved" me and I moved on with my life thinking I could do all things through him who strengthens me. The first two years or so--yeah it worked, in the sense that it gave me confidence to move on with my life. But I now know that it was my own inner strength that enabled me to make changes; if I had done all of what I did but not accepted Jesus and went to church, I still would have grown as a human being. But no, I believed...so beyond the first two years, I added almost 12 more in which I slogged on, trying to find that elusive "true xtianity". You could say that through out most of my xtian career, I still felt empty because of being unsatisfied with my church, their teachings, and their examples (whoa boy, don't get me going there!).
Really all humans probably have feelings of emptiness now and then. Especially in the USA, where a consumer/advertising culture pushes new products on you all the time, making you feel like if you don't perpetually buy the new models available you're being left in the dust by the Jones'. Doesn't Buddhism address this some, by saying the source of our unhappiness (emptiness?) is desire? Constant emptiness--now that's more serious; probably depression, or as in my case, lack of training in knowing how to manoeuver in the world (which then leads to depression). Emptiness; this is what the fundies take advantage of, with great success. Then they actually keep you in that state with their worm theology.
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A big revelation in my professional training was that humans can learn skills for living and relating. We don"t have to be desperate for a miracle of God to make us decent.--Marlene Winell
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bhoff1356
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8# |
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(Date Posted:03/26/2005 04:21:06)
Reply to : PhoenixFireWalker
what lies were YOU told e.g. in church?
My particular favorite lie: "Jesus died for your sins".
Everything that flows from that statement, and all the necessary assumptions about the nature of the world that lead up to that statement are lies. Or at least perhaps delusions.
While these were lies, at least I take some comfort from the fact (assumption?) that those who told me these lies did not do so knowing them to be lies.
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The Collective
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9# |
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(Date Posted:03/26/2005 06:17:38)
Reply to : PhoenixFireWalker
So, what lies were YOU told?
The WORST lies?.......
1) That I was an abhorrent abomination that deserved death, but that 'god' would 'heal' me if I only repented of my affliction (how exactly do you do that?) and ask for forgiveness and healing, then I would be 'healed'
2) That I WAS healed, cured, and proof of the miracles of 'god', and not brainwashed into | | |
